PRESENT: Chair Karen Leakey, Vice Chair and Treasurer Richard Coates, Secretary and Archivist Kevin Leakey, Minute Secretary John Phillips, John Clark, Karen Coulthard, Stella Edwards, Pam Freegard, Tim French, Kate Johnson, Alan Jones, Cluniford and Evelyn Mason, Rebecca McIntosh, Val Purvis, Derek and Madge Sutton, Ros Timlin.
ALSO PRESENT: John Taylor - Broadgreen Community Plan, PCSO Rees Turner, Councillor Mark Edwards - Cabinet Member for Resources, Councillor Derique Montaut, Nazma Ramruttun BOND representative, Dan Collins and Helena Lachowycz - Eastcott Community Council, Gena Old Town.
APOLOGIES FOR ABSENCE: John Banville, Vi Clark, Celia Cotton, Kath Cridland, John Freegard, Elizabeth Grady, Kath Jones, Pam Montgomery, Sue Osbaldstone, Mike and Lindsay Ponting, David Webb, Inspector Madge Lynch, PCSO Stuart Bird, PC Sophia McIntyre, Sergeant Kate Stalder.
CONFIRMATION OF THE MINUTES – 7th January 2009 meeting.
These Minutes were confirmed and signed a true record. Proposed Pam Freegard and seconded by John Phillips.
MATTERS ARISING FROM THE JANUARY MINUTES: Broad Street Community Trust. Father Leslie has been contacted yet again to ask what is happening with the Trust and if the £2000 we are holding could be used for the community garden, but as yet he has not responded. It was proposed that a letter be sent to Graham Jenkins and ask him if he felt the money could be spent on the garden project.
COMMUNITY POLICE REPORT – PCSO Rhys Turner: There have been several ‘Dobbin’ operations during February - 16/17/18 they were conducted with both High Visibility and Covert Officers deployed. A Kerb Crawler was issued with an ABC (Acceptable Behaviour Contract) and a “Working” person was issued with a Prostitution Street Caution. Letters were also distributed to registered keepers of cars that are continually seen loitering within the area, one has been sent to an address in Portsmouth; Police there will deal with it. The Police have spoken to local residents and businesses and people are happy with the operations that are being carried out. At the moment the ‘Dobbin’ operations are planned out until June, then PC. McIntyre will look to see what the situation is and decide the best way forward, it may well mean stepping up the ‘Dobbin’ operations. There is a long-term commitment from high up in the Police to eradicate the prostitution problem and PC McIntyre is very dedicated to her job.
Alley way parking continues to be a problem in some areas and a van that constantly does so in the alley behind Manchester road has been given 2 tickets in the last couple of weeks and if it continues to be parked there it will be towed away, as alleys should be kept clear at all times to allow emergency services access should there be a need to do so.
GUEST SPEAKER - Councillor Mark Edwards – Cabinet Member for Resources: Thanked the BSACC for the invite to talk about the proposed residents parking permit increases, and gave apologies for Councillor Peter Greenhalgh who he had hoped would also have been able to attend the meeting.
Legally the Council are obliged to balance their books and although he understood the financial situation at the moment, the council cannot take out huge loans. Every year there has to be a budget and every year expenses increase while income does not, and although £8m savings had been found and they were coming close to delivering a balanced budget, unfortunately since the credit crunch at the end of last year, there had been a huge income loss to the council from things like planning applications and recycling. To balance the books they had to go back and look again at all the savings that could be made, and one thing that was put forward as a proposal for change was the residents parking. Looking at the current cost and income, the books don’t balance and the scheme is running at a net loss and is being subsidised. The proposal is to put the cost of permits up by the amount suggested and that will go some way to cover the gap between what it costs to run and what income is generated.
There then followed a question and answer session.
Q: Are fines included?
A: Yes, it’s all part of the income.
Q: Is this not simply a stealth tax, put up the cost of residents parking permits and keep council tax lower for everyone else?
A: Not at all, we want to be very honest and open about it, but this is a service that is costing money and a way has to be found to make it more efficient. There is to be a consultation process on it but has no the details as to how it’s going to run yet. One option that has been floated before, which makes it cost effective, is if there were no residents’ parking in place it would be cost neutral. Every time this has been proposed the answer has been residents want to keep the scheme.
Q: If as you say the increases are to balance the books, people are going to expect to see more for their money, i.e. more people managing the scheme because there’s already problems with inconsiderate parking and illegal parking in the residents parking bays. More patrols etc will Increase the cost of running the scheme and not generate more income. If it is not managed properly there will be lots of complaints.
A: Enforcement has been looked at and savings made by making it run as efficiently as possible. The Council need to know from residents where the inefficiencies are in enforcement. They are down to 31 officers from 38 but the scheme was running reasonably well with 31 officers, so that number is being maintained.
Q: If you want to make savings, don’t use so many vans. How many do the parking department use?
A: Not know.
Q: Could residents parking not operate on a Sunday? Surely the fines would generate more income?
A: It was looked at, but is not cost effective to operate the scheme on a Sunday; the most cost effective solution is to put the cost of permits up.
Q: It would be helpful to get a figure on the shortfall of costs for the scheme, but never the less, how much are you expecting to generate from the price increase?
A: £152,000
Q: One thing that defeats that figure, is the increase in Councillors Allowances which is understood to be costing an additional £370,000 but if only half of that was given back by Councillors there would be no need to increase the residents parking charges at all, would there?
A: This is a very sensitive subject and will no doubt be debated at many future council meetings. There are lots of ways you could work things out, but to be on call 365 days of the year to 8,000 residents, it works out to be 50p to £1.00 per hour. From a personal point of view, looking at the amount of work and hours Councillors put in, in terms of evenings and weekends etc, the reward does not necessarily balance up with those amounts of hours. For example today – up at 6am, at this meeting now and have to go to another meeting after, this is a typical day in amongst the day job. These commitments are relatively tough, where everybody is working very very hard here. Weekends and evenings - you never know how late. The only reason that some of the people actually do the job as a councillor is because they can balance their work/job life, which means you may not be able to get a job that pays sufficiently to have a life or that allows you to do both, you have to balance both against the cost. Considering the amount of work that has to be put in to these roles, it’s a fair balance.
Q: With regards to the allowances, many people do voluntary work and carry on with their jobs as well, and they don’t expect to get paid.
A: As Chair of School Governors, I probably give 20 to 30 hours a week so we all do the voluntary stuff as well.
Q: Do you consider parking increases of between 60% and 200% reasonable and can residents in the present climate of recession absorb this? Why were the charges not phased in, if there’s never been a situation of having to balance the budget for the scheme?
A: Taken onboard that it is a big increase all in one go, the only counter argument to that is that maybe it should have been done last year, the year before that and the year before that. To put it up to the full cost all in one go was considered to be far too much and these increases were considered to be a reasonable compromise.
Q: There is also another option, where there has been a windfall of income coming into the council coffers of approximately £429,000, which could have been used to accommodate the shortfalls and cuts.
A: Completely understand the point that has been raised about this money from the Government but it’s one off funding, while it is very welcome, if it’s used for the Park and Ride for example, we will be sitting here in a years time having exactly the same discussion. Using one of funding to try and sustain something for the long term is not practical and not going to work, all it is doing is delaying the problem.
Q: Why are more permits issued than actual parking spaces?
A: It is known that this is an issue, there are discussions on the number of parking spaces and believe there is some capital funding which will potentially be available this year to look at the number of parking spaces and see if the number can be increased.
Q: Houses in Multiple Occupancy – why, when one person in one flat pays the cost of a first permit, should a totally unrelated person living in a separate flat within the same building have to pay the cost of a second permit as if it was a second car in the same household?
A: It should be on a per household basis, will take it back.
Q: You said the current option of increases was the most cost effective, what are the other options because it would be useful if they could be shared with residents? And with regards to the consultation process, will residents be consulted or will it just be councillors?
A: Will make sure the BSACC has full details on the consultation process and on the other options. The cheapest option is to scrap the scheme but residents want it.
Q: It was said that these increases will still not cover the cost of the scheme, does this mean that in the next couple of budgets the charges are going to increase again and again?
A: Here’s your answer, let me give you a clue - ‘The proposed price increases in permits are expected to realise an additional value of £152,000. In order to recover the full cost of the service leaving visitors, second and third permits unchanged, the cost of a 6 month first permit needs to rise to £30 and a 12 month permit to £55 compared with a £25 to £40 proposed’ so in order to make the whole thing cost neutral, it would take that level of increase.
Q: Part of people’s aggravation about this is that it is such a huge increase coming in, seemingly through the back door via a section in the budget – ‘Amendments and Omissions from December Report’ Would it not be better to set out the future rises over the next few years, now?
A: My job is to balance the books and I have only been in this role for 2 months, if we were to put out the fees for the next 3 years it sets them in stone, when through other savings they may not need to be increased. If we do find a way to make this service run efficiently, at a far less cost and it works for residents, I would be the first one to say we are going to cut the residents car parking fees.
Q: As there are no local council elections this year, could this be the reason that the charges are being put up by so much?
A: If we wanted to run a political budget next year, by keeping the council tax to 3.5% now we are creating a huge issue for ourselves next year. The political gain would be a 4.9% budget this year, because people would have forgotten about it next year. A 3.5% budget this year was one of the most difficult things this council has had to do in terms of balancing the books, you can be rest assured this was not political and I am up for re-election next year so the job is going to be even harder.
Q: Going through the paperwork to the residents parking review in 2007, it states that in 2005/06 there was an operating surplus of some £6300 and this was based on the old charges of £12 per permit, so how in the last couple of years has the cost of running the scheme suddenly gone up so much?
A: That is one of the questions we are trying to find the answer to, exactly where the 05/06 numbers were derived from. They don’t actually make sense, we are trying to find out what costs were not put in, because the current fees and numbers are correct.
Q: Basically up until December time, when the economic problems hit, you were not really bothered that the scheme was costing extra money; in fact you didn’t even know did you? (A: No, absolutely.) and suddenly it’s allegedly going to cost lots more money to run this so therefore you are going to be ‘taxing’ everybody extra (A: Absolutely not) you weren’t looking at this before, a budget was put to cabinet in December and it wasn’t included.
A: We didn’t get to the budget in December and decide to punish the residents parking, there were a whole raft of things that happened in December and January. It was always on the list, but we don’t want to touch things we don’t have to, I want to make these things cost neutral, it would be very easy to say we’ve got plenty of money in the bank but we will punish you for that as well. We have to make a balance and that is, when times are economically tough you have to look at absolutely everything. This should have been looked at 3 years ago with far more scrutiny. As the budgets become tighter, everything has to be scrutinised and you have to square every asset you have got in order to balance the books. So yes, the prices should have gone up 3 years ago.
Q: It was suggested by the Lib. Dems. at the full Council meeting, that quite a lot of the increase is due to added administration charges that have not been included before, is this correct?
A: That is what I am trying to work out. I am assured by our Finance Director that we are apportioning costs appropriately for residents parking in the 2008/2009 budget that has just gone through.
Q: Have you compared the cost of residents parking in Swindon, with other towns?
A: I can get you the figures, but I can assure you if you look at res. parking in equivalent Unitaries, this is incredibly cheap. I will get some numbers and get some balance and make it transparent - this is what it costs and in an equivalent Unitary this is what they pay, so you can get a benchmark.
I will come back with all of the responses to tonight and if there are any gaps let me know, and Peter Greenhalgh will come back with a response to the letter sent to him from the BSACC.
Everything that has been said will be taken back and will make sure there is a full feed back on this discussion and full feedback on how the consultation is going to take place, the BSACC will be kept fully informed.
CORRESPONDENCE:
The overflowing guttering on the shop in Corporation and Lagos Street – Richard Palacio SBC environmental officer said unless the adjoining property complains, then there is nothing they can do about it.
Fish being sold at both the 7 to 11 shop in Broad St. and DeAngelos in Manchester Rd. - Richard Palacio and Karen L have both tried to get the food hygiene enforcement team to the tasking group but they will not go, RP has however written to both shops so things are in motion within the council.
Tried unsuccessfully to contact Gary Hewitt with regards to the S4L and the garden, left numerous messages and been told he would get back but he has not.
Informed Parking Enforcement about Scorpion Garage in Station Road valeting cars etc and also that they are using the residents parking bays to park the cars in.
PLANNING APPLICATIONS: S/09/0268 - 123 Manchester Road - Erection of a single storey rear extension - Application Pending Consideration
TREASURERS REPORT: Acceptance of Treasures report proposed by Derek Sutton and seconded by Val Purvis.
CHAIR REPORT:
We are putting on a Community Engagement morning on the 28 March. The Police will have their computer equipment to enable residents to answer a survey about prostitution, John Taylor will be on hand to talk about the Community Plan, Kevin will be showing his history project and there will be a table top and cake sale. Help would very much be appreciated.
Doug Imrie has a funding application – ‘Kick it Out’ concerning racism in sport and young people.
The dog warden has been contacted again concerning the dog that is being allowed to run around in the park. Residents are reporting that it is going for young people in the street, and is being let out with no adult supervision, this happens at various times of the day.
The Tasking Group have been invited to visit the Manchester Road Mosque. If the BSACC are interested in a visit, it may be able to be arranged.
The Adver recently carried a story about a mugging and used the headline ‘Man injured in Broadgreen mugging’ it was felt that there was no need to have mentioned Broadgreen in the headline, because mentioning an area in the headline it is not something the Adver normally do. The Chair has contacted the Adver and they said often crime stories come direct from Police information and are reported as said. On a positive note, the Adver have run 2 good news stories about this area in the last couple of days.
It has been reported that some users of the Breakfast Club are using some of the back alleyways in the vicinity of St. Luke’s as a toilet, this is not just urinating either. It is hard to understand why this is happening, because the Breakfast Club has toilet facilities on site.
There is to be a ‘Safe and Clean’ day later in the year, it will however be shared with the Railway Village. It was felt by the meeting that this area needs a clear up of its own, especially the County Ground which is in a terrible state.
An email have been received from Ishmael Stevens, got married on the 13th December and is working long hours, only seeing his family on his days off. He hopes to visit Swindon in June and sends his love to all. Grace Walker has spoken to Karen C. and said she has settled in very well in Spain, she says she has not got a donkey yet, but she is happy relaxing and sipping cocktails in the sun! She would be very pleased if people would write to her.
Next month, Planning Enforcement will be attending this meeting. They have requested for any enforcement issues to be passed to them before the meeting, so they have the right paperwork with them, to answer the questions.
Councillor Montaut has booked a room at the Civic Offices for this Friday morning, so the Tasking Group and members of the Mosque can discuss the Friday parking problems. The Councillor said that since booking the room, he has been having problems with holding the meeting on a Friday, because the Muslims go to prayer on that day and it is inappropriate to hold it then. The Chair pointed out that at the Tasking meeting, Councillor Ali, PC Sheikh and the Manchester Road Mosque representative all said Friday morning was a good time.
YOUTH REPORT: Doug Imrie: Over the next few Wednesdays Doug is hoping to do some sports with the youngsters and also to arrange some football matches between older youths and possibly the Fire Brigade and Police etc.
Lindsay Poole: Over the past month, young people who attend Skeetz youth club on a Wednesday evening have been engaging in an art project alongside No Added Sugar community artists. Young people have been working hard to create self-portraits and have had the opportunity to work with Sid who is a young Asian artist who has been coming over from Bristol to assist with the project. We have another 2 evenings with No Added Sugar to finish the pieces and then hope to encourage a few of the young people to come in on Saturday 28th March to create some group pieces which we hope could be auctioned or raffled off at the Community Cohesion Day to raise money for the Skeetz youth club.
Numbers at Skeetz are still really good with around 30 young people attending each session - from a broad ethnic mix including young people originally from Pakistan, Bangladesh, Poland, Afghanistan and Lithuania - which promotes some interesting discussions about different languages and cultures.
One of the young people is now attending the Duke of Edinburgh Open Award centre on a Monday night at Plus One Centre and is progressing well. We are still trying to encourage the young people to get involved in other Youth Work activities in other areas, such as football tournaments, pool comps and gym sessions.... but this is proving quite difficult as they are very attached to their area and don't seem too keen to venture out and mix with other young people. So this is something we shall be addressing in the next few months as well as helping them to identify and apply for funding for future projects.
For more information about Skeetz or youth work in Central south area, please contact Lindsay Poole (Youth Development Worker) mob: 07919 111539 or lpoole@swindon.gov.uk
COMMUNITY PLAN: The steering group, a sub-committee of the BSACC that includes a representative from the BOND – Kay Malko and Councillor Montaut as the Council representative, has met for the first time and agreed to drive the plan forward. It is the aim to produce a 16 to 20 page plan, available for the Borough to see in October. There are 2 areas of immediate action, the Adver and the ‘20 is Plenty’ campaign, which is being headed up by Derek and Madge Sutton. It is hoped to persuade the council to trial 20 mph for all roads in this area. It is also important to engage with the New Swindon Company, Kevin has agreed to represent the Steering Committee, Pam and Ros the BSACC and Karen L the Tasking Group.
With regards to the ’20 is Plenty’ campaign, Cllr. Montaut said he was charged with raising this issue within the Council and has been having ongoing discussions with traffic engineers and they say that it is not as simple as adopting a scheme that’s been used in other areas because a 20mph zone is not enforceable by the Police, they have problems with 30mph, so by enforcing 20 mph by having Police Officers there will not happen. One way to have 20mph zones is through traffic calming. They can have a 20mph zone by putting up a sign with it on; they are talking about piloting this in a residential area, but not Broadgreen. Through his discussions thanks to the interest we have shown in this, at least they can start a pilot scheme in one of the areas. The side roads will be easy to enforce because great speeds would not be built up, it’s the main highways like Broad St. or Manchester Rd, so it is being discussed and considered at a higher level.
NEIGHBOURHOOD WATCH REPORT: There are still problems with the Breakfast Club, with drinking outside and cans etc littering the path, there has been no improvement since the last time. It was pointed out that the opportunity was given at the tasking meeting for the problems to be put directly to the organisations involved, but they were told it had improved and there was no problem. Cycling on paths and cars parking in the alleyways are also continuing. Despite this area having a DPPO, a resident is purchasing alcohol and drinking it with friends in the Broadgreen Centre park, they are getting drunk and abusing people, and then leaving the empty bottles behind. The DPPO sign by the park has been spray painted over, but the PCSO’s would like to see more DPPO signs in the area.
WARD COUNCILLORS REPORT: Councillor Montaut talked about the Council Budget and the issues around saving services like the libraries, Park and Ride and the cut in Community grants etc. He feels that these things could be saved through other savings. There is also a figure of £429,000 that has fallen into the Councils pot from Government, it is for Authorities that have made certain financial achievements after their budgets have been delivered, but we are told it is a one off payout and cannot be used to subsidise services, but Councillor Montaut does not agree this is the right way to look at it.
B.O.N.D: The BOND put on a multi-cultural event on the 28th February; Nazma thanked Karen L, Pam, Kate and Rebecca for all of their help on the day.
ANY OTHER BUSINESS: Can there be another public toilet in the Town Centre, because the alleyway behind the Open Hands Fellowship is being constantly used as a toilet. This was passed over to Cllr. Montaut who said that it is likely that toilets will continue to be shut, with people having to rely on traders opening their toilets for public use.
The Chair thanked Karen Coulthard for going around with the Residents Parking petition.
Date of next meeting: Wednesday 01 April 2009 Meeting closed at 9.20pm.
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